Thursday, May 03, 2007

Thoughts on The Brig...

* Whoah...that was quite some episode, no? Terry O'Quinn, Josh Holloway, and Kevin Tigh all gave Emmy-worthy performances. And, despite the previews, I didn't fully believe Sawyer would kill Cooper -- not to mention is such a darkly twisted (pun intended) way. It's like TPTB were channeling David Chase and the Sopranos...

* Interesting that Locke chose the Black Rock (as opposed to, say, the Pearl Hatch) to hold Cooper prisoner. Interesting, as well, that Rousseau showed up looking for dynamite -- and didn't seem to be the least bit phased to find Locke with a man locked in the brig. On a tangential note, Cooper's banging reminded me a lot of the scene from both film versions of Solaris wherein the Sartorius/Gordon character has a "visitor" (i.e., manifestation of someone from their past) that bangs around behind a locked door...

* Cooper said that he was in a car accident and the last thing he remembered was one of the paramedics smiling before injecting him with something. Cooper claimed to have awakened in the dark room where (and when) Locke confronted him. There are at least two odd things about Cooper's tale. First, does the smiling EMT and injection imply that Mittelos brought him to the Island? Recall that Juliet was knocked out for her journey. Recall, as well, that Ben told Tom to bring the "man from Tallahassee" (i.e., Cooper) which brings me to oddity two. Was Cooper sedated for the entire time he was on the Island, or was he lying? Or did he die off the Island and get resurrected on it? Perhaps via Smokey?

* On that last point, I found it curious that Cooper's story about Oceanic 815 's recovery so perfectly matched Naomi's. That may be for our benefit, and both could be victims (as opposed to perpetrators) of some cover-up, but I remain a tad suspicious until Naomi's bona fides are better established. In light of the podcast I linked to the other day, I could also see this as part of some further ruse to make our Losties resign themselves to life on the Island...

* The problem with the foregoing is the satellite phone, which Mikhail genuinely seemed to covet, and Sayid seemed to believe was real. (BTW: How hilarious was Hurley's explanation to Kate: "Uh, we found it in the luggage?"). But what was causing the interference, especially now that the Flame station was destroyed? Is this once again interference from the mysterious radio tower that Danielle mentioned? From the Island's EM field? Or is this further proof they're inside Desmond's snowglobe?

* Regarding the latter, Cooper's reference to them being in hell harkened back to Season 2, when Ben/Henry said God couldn't see them. I interpreted that line as proof they must be inside some sort of higher dimensional "box" but a poster named Ed Muse made a great counterpoint -- the one place God can't see them is hell. Check out Ed's take on 325 (the course Ben gave to Michael) which is positively brilliant even if I'm not sure I agree. What's really interesting is that the "answers" offered by recent episodes can stil be taken both ways.

* What did Juliet want to tell Kate? My first thought was the latter must be pregnant but the former's comment seems to be prompted by Kate's references to Naomi and the radio. I wonder if Juliet told something to Jack (e.g., the aforementioned interference and snowglobe possibilities) that would make him think satellite contact and/or a helicopter crash would be impossible. Perhaps they suspect another scam...

* If the Others are indeed working a scam, I suspect it's about to unravel. I had thought that Ben and Richard were on the same page but the latter's comments to Locke would suggest not. Indeed, Ben seemed perturbed when Locke repeated what Richard had told him. Is it possible Richard deliberately opened the "door" for Oceanic 815 as part of a move against Ben? Do Alpert's trips to the outside world make him somehow unwilling to tolerate Ben's iron rule?

* I also found it interesting how Richard introduced Locke to the Others preferred modus operandi -- getting someone else to do your dirty work. It's almost like Ben was testing Locke, and Richard gave away the answer -- presumably for Alpert's own purposes. I have a suspicion, however, that Locke is about to confound everyone's plans for him...

* A couple of interesting religious references last night. Ben's command that Locke sacrifice Cooper struck me as another (ironic) reference to the story of Abraham and Isaac. I was also struck by the disturbing image of Locke carrying his dead father's body -- talk about a cross to bear. A poster on the fuselage named Black Lotus has an interesting theory that Locke is a Messiah figure. I tend to think Aaron is the Messiah and that Locke is a kind of "John the Baptist" figure. After last night, however, it may be time to reconsider...

26 comments:

Danielle said...

I am still not sure what to think of the episode. Funny you should mention the Sopranos. I asked my husband if he thought the killing scene was a nod to the Sopranos and had to jog his memory on that episode. I can't remember if Sawyer had a knife or if that was just Locke. Have to watch it again. I'm not sure what to think of Richard--if his talk with Locke was part of Ben's plan or Richard's own agenda.

Danielle said...

A few further comments... I'm pretty sure Ben meant for Locke to "steal" that tape recorder. Ben is a master at manipulating Locke. I have a gut feeling now that Juliet will die, though I'm not sure if that is part of Ben's plan or not. I'm still pretty baffled by Naomi (and now Cooper's) flight 815 story. Just not sure what to think. Will have to re-watch the episode. I do think Cooper was drugged & brought to MI.

Annie said...

well... best episode so far Fo' Sho'!!!

First my thoughts on Cooper. What i took away from his description of how he got to the island is this: this is an old man's view of his abduction. They (perhaps Halpert and Ethan) rear-ended him, perhaps caused a concussion but i'm guessing not much more then that... the paramedics came and all he can remember is the paramedic smiling and putting in the i.v., well the only thing that popped into my mind when he said that is ETHAN!!! with his goofy "you probably shouldn't have drank all that in one shot" look.

and now the big question i've been pondering since last night.

WHAT IS JACK KEEPING FROM KATE?!?!

ok... a small voice inside me wants to be believe the following : Juliet hates Ben. She's decided to confide in Jack that the Others are coming for the women and she now wants Jack to help her fight them or turn them away or something. So "we should tell her" (we should tell her they're coming) "not yet". As per the some tv guide spoilers, Jack apparently will try something to get ride of the others... perhaps he doesn't want Kate to get in the way...

but then again there's another voice in my head that's telling me DONT TRUST JACK ANYMORE.

it's making me want to take down my Jack action figure, that's how upset i am about all this.

ME said...

Bigmouth
I was also thinking about Locke being a Messiah figure.
Last nights episode, to me, made it seem like they writers where leading us to think John and James where brothers of a sort. Both being MADE by Cooper.
Cooper asked
“What was your mothers name?”
James
“ My mothers name was Mary”
Now many, more so recently, have suggested that James was the brother of Jesus the Messiah.
Mark 6:3;
Matthew 13:55;
Acts 12:17, 15:13, 21:18;
Galatians 1:19, 2:9, 12; I
Corinthians 15:7
As soon as I heard JH say “My mothers name was Mary”
These thoughts crossed my mind. Found it all very interesting

Jason said...

This isn't really a deep thought post or anything, but I was curious if you think that Sawyer may be the next death (or at least the next target of Smokie) now that he has gotten over his preisland hangup.

And do you expect Rouseau's (terrible spelling) dynamite to come into play during the Others raid?

P.S. Keep up the great posts, it helps make some of the more boring work days go by quickly.

ME said...

Jason
I'm thinking that Rousseau and Sayid are working to together
( Sayid digging a whole) because they know the others are coming

Danielle said...

You know, when I saw that I thought, "what is Sayid digging a hole for." I hadn't thought of that (him working with Rousseau, but that could be it.

Mang said...

There is so much to say...

First, this episode can help solidify (pun intended) bigmouth's notion of a "Smokey-infused" manifestation. Look at Cooper, I never recall him having a deep, southern US accent before. Perhaps in James' mind, being from the South, the manifestation would match his perspective, and therefore gave Cooper the drawl. Of cousrse, we could say the same that James brought Cooper forth from the magic box and not Locke as Ben contends (manipulates).

Yet the multiverse possibility, that I also subscribe to (and post elsewhere) is the more intriguing theory. What if this group of islanders is a separate (but same) group as the ones that were purported by Cooper and the parachutist to be dead in the ocean? Perhaps through some rift, or anomalous energy (vortex, EMF, etc.) a wormhole was opened and a parallel existence was replicated here, one died to maintain balance, and the other survived on the island.

Using the same thought, could this Cooper also be a replicate, pulled from another dimension/reality? Or how about from a different time?

Setting aside all conspiracy/cover-up theories (which I love), if you want to get truly whacky, could the parachutist be of the same replication rift? Or how about THE FUTURE? Is her communication device too technologically advanced? Was Sayid emphatic enough in not ever seeing it before a sign that it is too advanced technically for our time, the the reception is not necessarily contravened by EMF, buyt that no receivers yet exist to grab a signal? Well, maybe this is far-fetched, but what the heck...

So many seem to think that Sawyer is now "Somkey-bait" given that he fulfilled his wish, but there are ways we can argue this. First, I don';t beleive that his intention was necessarily to kill Cooper (the real Sawyer), it was to get him to read THE ENTIRE letter that he wrote, understand the impact that it had and acknowledge the vailidity of it. James (Sawyer) never saw that fulfilled because Cooper/Cooper-Smokey/alternate-Cooper ripped it up and mocked it, leaving James' (Sawyer's) catharsis uncleansed and his journey unfilfilled, and perhaps his reason for being on the island maintained for the time.

I must take a breather, so much to say...

Mang said...

Regarding Jack, Juliet and Kate, I too thought that Jack was holding back on telling Kate that Juliet told hom that The Others were to infiltrate camp. The counter-argueent is that why wouldn't Jack want to consult Kate on planning a defense/counter-attack based on the strength, guile and intellect of Kate's character...

However, what if it was that Juliet told Jack about the gestation issues on the island, and both knew that Kate has the possibility of pregnancy, and that she was in danger?

Of course, the possibility exists that Sawyer could have called in The Trojan Man during his moments with Kate to grab something from his stash, but I doubt it. Maybe the information Jack wanted to withold was the pregnancy info.

But knowing LOST, it is something altogether different...

-Mang

Mang said...

Secondly, Kate would be in direct line for abduction by the Others on their next raid, assuming my previous logic is correct (and my assumptions), further raising the question why not to inform Kate.

-Mang

Jason said...

Thanks Big, I don't know why I still continue to forget about that hole Sayid was digging.

M The Alien said...

Hey big, not much time to post but i just wanted to say a few things.
First, The squirrel's of SM was great, especially for me because i currently have about 20 - 30 squirrels living in my attic that refuse to leave, so thanks for the pest control info. lol!

Locke and Sawyer were both slaves to their feelings towards Cooper, it was awesome that Sawyer killed him on a slave ship, using slave chains.

Rousseau needing dynamite wasn't very interesting to me, the amount she took was what I was concerned with.

I don't know if it was intentional or just my eyes playing with me but when Locke and Sawyer were leaving the ship the trees around the opening they are coming out of seem to make a fuzzy image of Yemi and Eko standing over them. Anybody else see this? The one day I need a screen cap and I can't find any from this episode, as soon as I find it, i'll post the link here.
I'll finish later, boss is comming!

Bigmouth said...

Danielle: Hmmm...I hadn't even considered the possibility that Ben wanted Locke to steal the recorder -- interesting! It's almost like Ben knows Alpert is conspiring against him and is trying to spark a clash with our Losties to eliminate the threat.

Annie: Halpert or Alpert? LOL -- I'm a big fan of the Office, too! I'd love it if Dwight said at some point: "2 pictures of Penny + 2 Planes = Multiverse." Seriously, though, I TOTALLY thought of Ethan's creepy smile myself when Cooper said that. As for Jack, I don't trust him either, but I still suspect that what Juliet told him relates somehow to the Island's location.

Me: Whoah...you just set my face to stunned -- great catch re Sawyer's mommy being Mary!

Jason: Maybe not deep, but right on target, imo -- and your spelling of Rousseau was only one letter off. Anyway, I'm worried about Sawyer, too. Right now, if I had to handicap it, I'd say Kate, Sayid, and Charlie are the likeliest candidates to die. But Sawyer is definitely a dark horse now that his story arc seems to be complete. There was something reminiscent of Eko's refusal to repent in Sawyer's murder of Cooper.

Me: Another great catch re Sayid digging a hole -- you're on a roll! Sure sounds like he and Rousseau are on the same wavelength. Perhaps that's why she showed up for the dynamite? Conflict is in the wind...

Danielle: Another interesting analogy is to Ana Lucia's tiger pit...was he digging before or after receiving news of Naomi?

Mang: That is a brilliant catch re Cooper's exaggerated Southern drawl! I noticed it but didn't get the significance until now. IMO, this tends to support the Smokey/manifestation angle insofar as a Cooper drawn from Locke's memories might be distorted or "off" in subtle ways. At the same time, Cooper's bite seemed to signal that he's a real person -- reminded of when one character pinches another to prove it's not a dream. I'm with you regarding multiverse, which is my preferred theory, too. Truthfully, I'd be banging this drum more loudly if the most recent podcast hadn't implied that the plane was a cover-up. There also was an interesting opportunity to signal the multiverse scenario -- e.g., Cooper could have insisted that he remembered Sawyer but not Locke -- or vice versa. But writers didn't bite, though it's still possible that Naomi will serve this purpose.

You make a great point that Sawyer's story isn't complete because Cooper never actually read the letter. Still, now that the letter is destroyed and Cooper killed, I think it will be tough to continue that story. I'm still struck by the parallel between Sawyer's return to murderous form and Eko's refusal to repent. Of course, it's also possible that Sawyer killing Cooper was somehow cathartic. Think back to Boone's encounter with Shannon and Smokey back in S1 (i.e., after Locke dosed him with hallucinogenic paste). Her influence kept him from committing fully to life on the Island, so Boone had to watch her die to liberate himself. As for Kate, Jack, and Juliet, pregnancy was the first thing that popped into my head, too. But I actually think you've nailed it with the news of the raid angle...I like that!

Nancy said...

Wow.... Ok, I've been riveted to LOST since the first 5 minutes of the pilot episode aired and I think I can finally say, "I give up. I have ~no~ idea what's going on and I simply can NOT speculate further!!"

Whew! Ahhhhh.... I feel so much better. I... I feel... Liberated! Freed from the bonds that tied me to my former existence! So ~this~ is what it's like to be an "other"? ;D

Ok, seriously now. I used to be a regular poster on the original OWA message boards. I had theories, explanations, guesses, you name it. Not anymore....
Bigmouth! Help! I have amnesia!
1) What did Sawyer mean when he tackled Locke and said that Ben already conned him once with a "number on a rabbit" (or something like that)??
2) When the "Others" gathered around Locke to "watch" him kill his father, it immediately made me think of Jack in the cage and the Stewardess from the Oceanic Flight who said, "They told us to watch..." I remember she looked puzzled at the time, but now, she's an old pro (and she seems to be watching over the Tailie children now too). But what I can't remember was, what were they there to "watch" when Jack was in the cage? Did we see that? If not, did Jack go through some rite of initiation? The same kind that Locke failed? Is Jack an "other"?
3) is it just me or is there something more symbollic about the Others' handshakes than just handshakes? What I mean is, in the episode where Kate brings Sayid & Locke to the Others' camp to rescue Jack, the camera focused in in Jack & Ben's handshake. Then, when Jack went to see Kate, he shook the Other's hand at the door, but it was a little prolonged... ah crud. Maybe I'm parinoid.

Lastly, I don't think Jack & Juliette reacted the way they did until Kate mentioned the phone.... the same phone that Mikael (sp?) wanted so badly. Why would Juliette want to let Kate in on something so quickly anyway? Unless she needs the phone? Why would Jack question Charlie so intently on the camping trip, and be satisfied with his obvious blundering lies, unless he knew something about what Charlie was trying to cover up?

Gah!! Head hurts... must go... sleep.

sorry for the long comment. I just love this blog so much more than the overrun message boards. Thank you!!! :D

Me said...

1) What did Sawyer mean when he tackled Locke and said that Ben already conned him once with a "number on a rabbit" (or something like that)??

He was referencing when Ben held the cage with the bunny in it, over Sawyer. The bunny had a 8 on it.
Ben him it had the same kind of implant as the one they put in Sawyer. Then Ben shook the cage and the bunny dies. Told Sawyer that if his blood pressure were to rise he would die just like the bunny.
Turns out they just gave the bunny a sedative and it fell asleep. He coned Sawyer to get him to cooperate.

Me said...

Ben Told him it
That is supposed to read *agghhh*

Nancy said...

((Slaps forehead)) D'oh! How could I forget that? Thanks "me." =)

Say.... speaking of implants. They put one in Claire. What's to stop them from actually putting one in Sawyer for that matter?

Bigmouth said...

M: Amazing catches! I especially love the symbolism of Sawyer strangling Cooper with slave chains! I have a feeling that wasn't a coincidence and may connect back to the choice of the Black Rock for this particular showdown. Magnus was, after all, a slaver and free will keeps getting emphasized on the show. As for Danielle, how much dynamite did she take, and what do you see as the significance? I have a feeling she's about to try to rescue Alex. How ironic would it be if she kills Ben in the bargain? Didn't see the Yemi/Eko apparitions but will check tonight...

Nancy: Muhuhuhahahahaha! Did you really think it would be so easy to leave speculations about Lost behind? I thought Ben was clear -- no one may leave the Island, not even you. Seriously,though, verrrrry interesting parallel between Cindy's interactions with Jack and Locke. I also was struck by the similarity to that creepy scene in The Other 48 Days when AL awoke to Goodwin staring and smiling at her. Something to keep in mind, however: Cindy and co. were apparently there to "watch" Juliet's trial. What if they were really there to watch Cooper get punished? Interesting point about the handshake -- I'll have to keep my eyes peeled for future examples. Is it possible Jack was slipped something, like maybe a note? Finally, I totally agree re the phone -- there's something about it that's important. Too big a coincidence now that it's caused two big reactions (i.e., Mikhail's and Jack/Juliet's).

Me: Yep, that's right. It's also a reference to a Stephen King essay that asks readers to imagine a caged bunny with an 8 on its back.

Nancy: Good point! Absolutely nothing, except maybe the Others' lack of genuine interest in Sawyer. I feel like he was taken mostly to manipulate Kate and Jack. Ben seemed almost disappointed by Kate's apparent interest in Sawyer, if you'll recall...

ME said...

Me: Yep, that's right. It's also a reference to a Stephen King essay that asks readers to imagine a caged bunny with an 8 on its back.

Big
What King book is this in?
I myself have not read S. King in a long time. Last book of his I read was The Stand and that was a Looooong time ago.

Bigmouth said...

Me: On Writing, which is a collection of essays. Here's the link to the wiki:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/On_Writing

I myself am a huge Stephen King fan -- The Stand is probably my favorite. I've long argued that he's a much better writer than many give him credit for being, though he needs a good editor to really shine. I'm so pleased to see him finally get some critical respect, though I worry it will make him even more self indulgent. One gem you don't hear about so much is The Eyes of the Dragon, which is almost more fantasy than horror. I also think the Talisman, which he wrote with Peter Straub, gets unfairly maligned. It has, however, been a while since I read either. Recently finished Cell (about a cell phone virus that causes the zombie apocalypse) which was good but not great.

Annie said...

Bigmouth! Halpert, Alpert, Bears, beets, Battlestar Galactica. LOL Sorry guess is got confused for a second there :)

Just wondering if you happen to have read the Dark Tower books. I'm not a big big fan of Stephen King but i have read all the Tower books and related works...which happen to include The Eyes of the dragon, The Talisman, Salems lot, The Stand, From a buick 8 and about 15 or so more. I love all things related to the tower and i you do too you should check out the graphic novel thats out now (third issue out of seven is currently out) its pretty frackin awesome :)

Nancy said...

Stephen King has always been a guilty pleasure of mine as well. I ~loved~ the fact that "Carrie" was Juliette's choice for the Others' Book Club!

Here's what the Others had to say about Carrie:
ADAM: It's not even literature. It's popcorn.

AMELIA: And why isn't it literature, Adam? I'm dying to know.

ADAM: There's no metaphor. It's by-the-numbers religious hocum-pocum.

AMELIA: No metaphor?

ADAM: It's science-fiction -- now I know why Ben isn't here.

JULIET: Excuse me?

ADAM: I know the host picks the book; but seriously, Julie, he wouldn't read this in the damn bathroom.

JULIET: Well, Adam, I am the host and I do pick the book. And this is my favorite book. So I am absolutely thrilled that you can't stand it. Silly me for sinking so low as to select something that Ben wouldn't like. Here I am thinking that free will still actually exists on...(then the plane crashes outside)

And here's what Ben had to say"

"I was just finishing Carrie. I still don't know why you picked it, but boy is it depressing."

This all cracked me up because "Carrie" is about a girl with Telekenesis... which I do believe would fall under one of the Dharma Initiative categories of study...

Bigmouth said...

Annie: I've read all of them except the last, though I do know how it ends from various Lost theories. Truthfully (and don't hate me!) it's not my favorite of his efforts. I loved the post-apocalyptic wastelands (Blaine!) and inter-dimensional aspects but felt the story dragged every time Roland had a flashback to his gunslinger days. Then, to devote a whole volume to Roland's tale of Susan...King just lost me. But I obviously agree re the others you mention, especially Salem's Lot, which first got me interested in King. I also want to mention Pet Sematary, which never gets any respect (perhaps because of the ridiculous title and even sillier cover picture) which I think is another of his best. The whole first half is basically character and setting development...

Nancy: Don't feel guilty -- be proud! I certainly recall the dialogue you quote, but re-reading with fresh eyes is nonetheless revealing. For example, I originally focused on Adam's characterization of Carrie as "by-the-numbers religious hocum-pocum," which suggested to me that Dharma may once have had messianic ambitions. Maybe the Others don't believe in mystifying the special children they attend. Now, however, I find myself fixating on Adam's comment that Carrie was "science fiction." In light of recent podcast comments that the show's answers exist at the borders or the paranormal, I wonder if Adam was a subtle jab at fans who dismiss certain theories as "science fiction."

Anonymous said...

Is it possible that Ben's true test was to test that Locke is not a murderer?

Locke could totally be the messiah figure, but could he be that if he were a killer? Probably not. Ben wanted to prove that Locke wasn't like most of the other "losties," most of whom have killed someone in their past or have since arriving on the island. Locke, as far as we know, has not.

R.C. said...

Also,

Does anybody else think that Kate & Jack are brother and sister?

Why wouldn't the others push Jack and Kate together, knowing that she also had the hots for Jack?

All of their blood has been taken -its been talked about - Juliet said she knws Jack's blood type. Is it possible that she knows Jack and kate are brother and sister?

Bigmouth said...

Anonymous: After The Man Behind the Curtain, I'm inclined to think that Ben was setting Locke up for failure -- trying to taint him. The same was true of Mikhail. In both cases, Richard intervened to preserve Locke's purity...

rc: LOL! That thought, which reminds me of Luke and Leia in Star Wars, has DEFINITELY crossed my mind. However, I think the blood test was a reference to Kate being preggers. My guess is that they will use her as bait in a trap for the Others -- culminating in Kate's tragic death.